Why Idle games make good satire, and how it was ruined.
Thought Slime
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07.11.2021
This perfectly explains why people willingly give in to games like War Thunder and World of Warships.
I love the delivery at 12:38.
ehhh i got bored when i hit the wizard tower
Universal paperclips
Your cookie clicker summary was amazing
I remember I played cookie clicker in its beta form, it was so different compared to cookie clicker even 6 months after that. It was so fun at the time because it was fresh and new but now that it's been years it makes me kinda wanna play it again to see if I can find that wonder again
There is absolutely nothing in the notion of capitalism that you have to make more and more money forever, you are seeing somehing that isn't there, you are just convinced that the regular human and lifes drive to want more is somehow a capitalist thing. On a side note, meritocracy is also not a capitalist idea? Both go married togethee but nobody with two brains belives money should go for people that "deserve" it, money is not a prize, it is a resource that is voluntarily traded, and in fact should be indeed just a resource to drive tje point home, silver discs, unbranded, much better than any coined bullshit or piece of paper.
Ugh ty, Adventure Capitalist is such a soulless clinical take on the genre. Idlegames are still games, thats why they still need to tell stories or have interesting mechanics to be popular. If any of you have tried games like Adventure Capitalist/Communist and thought wow, this is extremely monotonous with no payoff, there are no surprises and there are no challenges, try playing NGU Idle instead. I was more captivated with NGU Idle than I was with almost every triple A title that Id purchased in the last few years. Yeah its bit silly and irreverent in ways that appeal to a certain demographic, but its proof that the Idle genre isnt just a parody of games, but an alternative look at what gaming means/is. Its also basically ruined "grinding" for me in other types of games like JRPGs, because even though it doesnt have the high budget audio/visuals, the way that it segments progression and allows you to participate (albeit to a lesser degree) without being at your computer means that you never truly feel like youre artificially and arbitrarily spending X amount of time because the game wants you to.
fun fact: in cookie clicker you can buy child labour
This video makes me wanna play Cookie clicker lol.
I didn’t know cookie clicker went this fucking deep goddamn
I have taken every drug, and drunk every alcohol known to man at the same time.
I AM…. NOW……….. THE COOKIE!
An I don't think I could come up with half the BS they put into this game.
Ironic Im playing ff14 and they hid a level behind "weapon level" the last god damn level behind it. crazy
quatrodecilion??? hehe that is so cute ….Q.Q im at the vigintillion…………….help
I think calling all video games skinner boxes misuses the definition. The defining feature of skinner boxes is that it convinces you the action you're doing is itself enjoyable when in reality you just want the reward it provides. Playing Contra or Mega Man isn't a traditional skinner box because the platforming is the goal, and if it isn't enjoyable and you're just doing it for the boss fight the game isn't doing its job and even then it isn't repetitive enough to convince you the bad parts in the tunnel are the end of the tunnel. Compare to WoW where there are literally parts that aren't gameplay that are repeated in perpetuity so you want to do them instead of the expensive to develop novel gameplay.
I played cookie clicker back in the day when it was actually just a normal idle game. I never expected it to have become such an interesting anticapitalist critique afterwards
"Maplestory or Everquest" and then proceeds to show a screen shot of World of Warcraft LUL
hate that I hyperfixate on idle games
That was depressing.
Step 1: Don’t play idle games.
Step 2: There are no other steps, you’ve won this particularly easy battle.
5:30 wheeze
dopamine isn't actually released as a reward, it's released in anticipation of a reward. It is released the moment you see the slot machine, or the moment before you pull the lever. It is why you will continue to choose to scroll facebook even though you never feel any payoff, because it's the anticipation of reward that releases dopamine and drives you.
There are also other neurotransmitters that have a role in causing pleasure
Hey.. Fuck you, guy.. I watched this vid at release and now I'm on my 6th ascension in cookie clicker.. Come for the critique.. stay for the skinner box..
If anyone's looking for a more active and a more thought based idle game I can recommend a game called "Your Chronicle" and it's probably the best idle game I've ever played. You start out as a village boy with RPG stats like Health and Mana, but that's it for the moment. You slowly get a resource called destiny that provokes an interesting story and a combat system that's a little more thinky besides just having faster and stronger attacks and you can even recruit the monsters that you defeat through a well thought-out process. It's a Free game on kongregate and steam and I can say after clocking in 1200 hours that its a must try.
1:48 um.. the windows vista?
Play universal paper clips
Dopamine is not a fucking pleasure chemical. Every fucking time I see a youtube video that goes on this topic its 'Dey squirt da dopamine in the brain" and gloss over it to make their point. Its not a pleasure chemical. Its associated with a ton of different things including decision making and attention and the creation of memories and that is why it plays a role in addiction but not pleasure. Roulette players who lose big get a comparable amount of dopamine going through their brains as the ones who win or accomplish something because it is a prediction error system and not a reward in itself. Dopamine doesn't even fire necessarily when you get something good! Only when you get something unexpected and that can be something good or bad.
This isn't to say that game companies don't try to exploit you to get you to spend money or do a bunch of grinding but every time I see people just go "Oh da dopamine" I just stop listening because its a very outdated and uninformed view of the chemical and neuroscience in general and maybe you should feel a little bad for pushing that because I would go so far as to say that boiling addiction down to dopamine is actually HARMFUL to the way we see these things. Serotonin is a pleasure chemical, endorphins are a pleasure chemical, oxytocin is a pleasure chemical, dopamine is not a fucking pleasure chemical. It does play a role in linking pleasurable experiences to the action that caused them and that makes you want to do them again by creating a memory that reinforces the experience but it definitely isn't the ONLY or even main driver of addiction even within neurochemicals and saying that it is just spreads this harmful myth further.
One like for Grumbletum.
I genuinely thought Adventure Capitalist was a critique of Capitalism until they came out with Adventure Communism…
I need merch that says “I do it for the goomba”
epic
As you are talking about this…….im playing cookie clicker lol
Jim Stephanie Sterling covered this quite a bit. Still, I like the more unique take about Cookie Clicker and Adventure Capitalist.
Adventure Communist is alright.
The funny thing is that it’s not criticism exactly. It’s just an idle-style game.
Doesn’t mean I don’t play it.
1:39 oh, its a play on progress bars and loading, i think
homestuck does this too
Ready to hear something that will make you cry? I know a guy who was WAYYYY into cookie clicker. But uhh… he's into PragerU and buys into ALL their bullshit. It's a yikes from me, because I think the point went WOOSH past him.
Why are so many of the captions wrong?
My favourite idle game is Universal Paperclips for a similar reason!
EDIT: Also, I figured the Adventure Capitalist people missed the mark after they released Adventure Communist which had no idea what communism actually is.
Cookie clicker was the BEST – it was so big in middle school(?) i think
no mention of Universal Paperclips and theory behind it?
btw dopamine is not about rewards, it's about an EXPECTATION of reward (unless there's been new research since I last looked into it)
none of the stuff you described happening in cookie clicker is bad, so it doesn't really work as satire
I have baked over a fifth of a quattuordecillion and I'm barely more than a week into my run.
I played Realm Grinder for a long time, a very similar game to Cookie Clicker and idle games are… pretty simple. I still play it from time to time but I do realize how it can be much more dull than an easy game, but it's something to do when you don't have the energy to do anything else lol
11 Weeks later and I just stopped playing Cookie Clicker after getting all my Heavenly Upgrades and my Idleverse count up to 452. I was going to go to 500, but there isn't anything else to do (that I would enjoy doing). I never messed with the plants/garden or the stock market. My current CPS is 2.4 quattourdecillion per second. I have 7 quindecillion cookies right now, and the highest total I ever saw was just over 1 sexdecillion a week or so ago.
I got most of the upgrades, but not all. It was fun getting some (under 15 min to 1 million cookies, true never click). At the end I got good at getting a X7 Frenzy combined with a X1111 Dragon Flight combined with a 7 second multiplier from selling 4,200 buildings in under 2 seconds (600 each of the first seven buildings). But after a while, I got tired of doing that over and over and over.
Also, towards the end, I got tired of waiting for sugar lumps. So a few days ago I just cheated and gave myself 999. I did up my clicker to level 20, but that was the only thing I really enjoyed. The rest was, meh. But because they gave me a bonus, I never used any of them along the way, except for maybe a dozen I spent during the first couple weeks when I didn't really know their main benefits.
Was glad to enjoy another addiction for a while, but also glad it's over.
Here is the code, if you're curious…
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For grumbletum 👍
Here I thought Candy Box was popular just because of a widespread appreciation for ASCII art!
A lot of this video’s talking points are stolen from alt shift x’s video
Respect for the Contra example.
This guy's videos are as useless as ever. Nobody treats capitalism in this manner, nobody reveres it. It's tool used to forge and maintain inegalitarian hierarchial social structures. People want these structures and use Capitalism to justify them inside of a Universal morality.
This comment is to feed Grumbletum.